여기, '만취해서 길에 쓰러진 사람들'과 관련하여, 한국사회에서 통용되는 또 다른 오랜 믿음들이 있습니다.
① 가장 나쁜 사람은 함께 술을 마신 자.
② 나쁜 사람은 무관심하게 지나치거나 경찰에 연락하지 않는 자.
③ 머저리들은 그렇게 위험에 처한 사람들을 놀잇감으로 삼는다(조롱하거나 사진을 찍거나) ← 솔직히 이건 한국에서는 상상할 수조차 없는 일이었습니다.. 블랙아웃코리아의 창조적인(?) 활동이 있기 전까지..
제가 아는 모든 사람들은 2번을 의식하고 있으며 오직 소수만이 여전히 1번을 맘 속에 담아두고 있습니다. 그러나 불행히도 저는 우리가 3번으로 이동함을 느낍니다. 블랙아웃코리아의 머저리들에 보다 가까운 수준으로 말이지요.
블로그를 운영하면서 저는 한국 학교들이 '원어민 선생님'으로서 젊고 반반한 얼굴들을 선호함을 알 수 있었습니다. 저의 한국어 블로그를 통해 방문하신 분들께서는 부디 기억해주세요, "우리 학교에는 연륜 있고 바른 심성의 선생님들이 필요합니다."
Postscript(written after 34 hours) : From the first of this blog, I have been trying to keep my position in the center of Public Opinion(as a Korean). Although there is a possibility of misreading it, I find the public opinion is easily affected(spoiled) by light feelings spreading out in society. The start of this counter-blog against Black Out Korea was already spoiled and that's my clear fault which I should remember until my death. I'd better to keep my old belief that somebody loving Korea is a Korean. I'm so sorry to such English teachers in Korea.
Here are another old beliefs fading in Korean society, related to passed out persons on streets :
① The worst people are who drank with them.
② The bad people are who passed by them without trying to care or calling police.
③ Idiots treat them as playthings(ridiculing, taking a memorial picture..) ← Frankly this was an unimaginable thing in Korea before the creative(?) works of Black Out Korea Blog.
All Korean people whom I know stay in consciousness of #2 and only small portion of us still keep #1 in minds. But unfortunately I feel we are going to #3, closer to the idiots of Black Out Korea Blog.
As managing this blog, I could realize that Korean academies(public or private) prefer young good faces as teachers. Visitors coming through my Korean blog, please remember we need old good minds in our academy.
Yesterday afternoon I found it's difficult for me to respond to all English comments, now I open comment section again. Probably I can't respond, SORRY. Just one kind of comment will be surely deleted, which tries to legitimize the optical violences of Black Out Korea.
※ To idiots coming from Black Out Korea : We won't forget you all. It's seriously because we should not be similar to you.
This blog was born with seemingly wrong named URL and Main-title AFTER some information was taken about the author of Black Out Korea. My first choice of them was reasonable and logical at that time. BUT As I repeated several times, just because there are many English teachers having good(beautiful) minds in Korea, I don't insist 'everything is right on this blog' any more. (←written after 36 hours in response to a comment/ check 'Reactions')
[The body of this post]
It's a clear fact that
한국에서 영어를 가르치는
Probably you remember what happened in Abu Ghraib.
아부 그라이브 포로수용소에서는 이런 일들이 일어났다.
(ridiculing & taking memorial pictures of people who lost resistance)
Now in Korea! They are ridiculing drunken people on roads with much pleasure! Find your teachers!
그리고 지금 당신의 원어민 영어교사들은 한국에서 이런 장난을 즐기고 있다.
(ridiculing & taking memorial pictures of people who lost resistance)
Additional Notes(written after 17 hours) : When I opened this blog with much anger to Black Out Korea Blog, I noticed something wrong here soon. Yes, it's believable that there are many good English teachers in Korea. So 'most English teachers are not (morally) qualified' is wrong. In fact, I already decided to shut down this blog within
"The bad minds tempting you to take a joyful picture with someone in danger are exactly same with the minds got powered in Abu Ghraib."
추가 내용(17시간 후) : 내가 '블랙아웃코리아'에 잔뜩 화가 나 이 블로그를 개설했을 때, 나는 곧 여기 뭔가 잘못이 있다는 걸 알아챘다. 맞아, 한국에는 많은 수의 좋은 영어 강사들이 활동하고 있을 것이다. 그래서 '대부분의 영어 강사들이 (도덕적으로) 자질이 없다'는 발언은 틀렸다. 사실상,
"네가 위험에 처한 사람과 즐거운 사진을 찍도록 뽐뿌질하는 마음은 한때 '아부 그라이브'를 장악했던 마음과 완전히 동일하다."
Additional Notes(written after 19 hours) : When I was an officer of Korean Army, my small military unit was in charge of the central
Drink → Blow off superior's head → Drive → Drink → Be caught
Idiots of Black Out Korea Blog may shout, "It's Cooool." Each day, I had to force my soldiers to catch the drunken killer. But we were not armored to avoid a street battle with him. It was so cool night.
You, foreigners from the west tend to regard yourselves as forward cultured people. It's not! Most of you are? It's not too! Only a few of you are really forward cultured people.
추가 내용(19시간 후) : 내가 중부전선 최전방에서 근무할 때, 3년 동안 2명의 미군이 상관을 총으로 쏴 죽이고 탈영했다. 그들은 모두 취했었지만 결코 땅바닥에 드러누워 잠들지는 않았지. 대신, 그들은 맥주집에 보다 빨리 도착하기 위해 차를 몰았다.
마시고 → 상관의 머리통을 날려버리고 → 운전하고 → 또 마시다가 → 잡혔다
'블랙아웃코리아'의 머저리들은 아마도 외치겠지, "와우 멋진데" 그 각각의 두 날에, 나는 부하들과 그 술취한 살인자를 잡으러 나섰다. 그러나 우리는 그와의 시가전을 피하기 위해 무장하지 않았다. 정말 추운 밤이었다.
당신들, 서양에서 온 외국인들은 자신들을 '앞서가는 문화시민'이라 간주하는 경향이 있다. 그렇지 않아! (모두는 아니더라도) 대부분은 그럴까? 역시 그렇지 않아! 당신들 중 고작 몇몇만이 진정으로 앞서가는 문화시민이다.
Additional Notes(written after 24 hours) : My friend(Korean) introduced me a comment in Black Out Korea Blog and that made me definitely sad → "I have my masters degree in teaching. I've lived in Korea for almost 10 years. I am studying Korean. But I wont stay in Korea. No matter what I do I will never be welcomed here. A few people act stupid and I always get blamed as well for their mistakes. Everyone thinks that because I am white I am a looser who couldnt get a job back home. Korean's tell me to get out of their country. Why did your country invite me here then? / Why cant we see this blog for what it is? The passed out people are idiots and so are the people posing with them. This is not a Korean or a foreigner issue. Both groups are idiots."
추가 내용(24시간 후) : 친구가 블랙아웃코리아에 오른 댓글 하나를 소개해줬고 그것은 나를 완전히 슬프게 만들어버렸다 → "나는 교육학 석사 학위를 가지고 있다. 이곳 한국에서 거진 10년을 살았지. 나는 한국어를 공부한다. 그러나 난 이 곳에 머무를 수가 없군. 내가 뭘 하든 난 여기서 환영받지를 못해. 몇몇이 멍청한 짓거리를 하고 나는 항상 그들과 똑같은 비난을 받는다구. 내가 (그들과 같은) 백인이고 본국에 돌아가면 직장을 얻지 못할 패배자이기 때문에 그런 대접을 받아야 한다고 모두들 생각해. 한국인들은 나더러 그들 나라를 떠나라고 한다. 그럼 너네 나라는 왜 날 여기에 불러들였어? / 왜 우리 모두는 이 블랙아웃코리아 블로그가 진정 무엇인지를 알아채지 못하는 걸까? 만취한 사람들은 머저리들이고 그들을 놓고 사진을 찍는 사람들도 역시 머저리들이야. 이건 한국인이냐 외국인이냐의 문제가 아니야. 양쪽 다 머저리들이다."
Idiot Photos were from GREAT 'Black Out Korea' Blog.
[Reactions]
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ZenKimchi said, "Yeah, the only thing I see bad about this is the passed out drunks. And it doesn't look like those are all English teachers."
Answer : It's clear that all of drunken people in photos are not all of Korean adults. But it's not clear if those idiots ridiculing the drunken people are not all English teachers. Additionally repeatedly it's a clear fact that
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Stafford said, something funny.
Answer : You forgot who you were but I remember you who insisted your privacy against Google Street Views. I don't have much to say about 'English Teachers in Korea' any more because I have friends in them. Just hope you to realize a fact that you can sleep on a street in Korea. No one will hurt you as you heard a news in your country. Your only one crisis is to be uploaded on the Black Out Korea Blog with smiling idiots.
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holterbarbour said, "Iraqis seem really conservative, but they really let go at night! You can't go anywhere around Baghdad late at night without seeing a bunch standing around naked with bags on their heads, lying down on floors with collars and leashes around their necks, getting into naked pyramids and such. But seriously, if they're cool with such self-imposed humiliation, why not pose for a picture with them?"
Historical Notes for the others : When I saw his comment first I thought he made a some point. His looked educated. So I visited his blog and left a comment, "You and I are all educated persons.. but you seemed to make a mistake on writing a comment on my blog. Please check yours again." Now I find he has erased his blog clearly instead of correcting his wrong comment :-/ Therefore I made an archive of his blog (totally) for him kindly as a pdf file, so "holterbarbour, call me whenever you need to view your past blog."
※ here is his comment
※ here is a portion of his blog Urggg...
+ It's hard to accept you are a (most?) benign person who smiles at trivially interesting findings in everyday life. You and I know that you have a special ability to find out FREAKING Super Mario in a bus. You can find FREAKING one in a group of Korean people! / If I were you, I would say, "I'm sorry. The last sentence of my comment was a joke." There is no reason to chase you if you are not in those idiot photos. At least I'm chasing NO one because I have much work to do like you.
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Darth Babaganoosh said, "First of all, define "qualified". Second, just for the argument's sake, let's assume you're right: most English teachers in Korea are not qualified to teach English. My question then becomes: Whose fault is that? Is Korean Immigration at fault for only requiring a university degree and a clean criminal record as qualifications? Or are schools at fault when they refuse to hire more qualified teachers, choosing instead to hire younger teachers with ZERO teaching background or experience? I have a background in English education and 20+ years of teaching experience in several subjects--not only English--in four different countries, and yet I've lost more than one job to "teachers" fresh out of university, who have never had a job before, have never taught before, and have no background in education. So whose fault is it again that "unqualified" teachers get hired in Korea, and experienced teachers are not?
Answer : I am a mechanical engineer in Korea. My Korean Blog is http://dynafeel.blog.me. In Korea, a teacher is the teacher advising what is right(or wrong). Probably you know our problems exactly. You should be our teacher! PLEASE open your Google Profile for any Korean School Administrator to show respects to you.
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Foreigner Joy said, "Schools ask for certain qualifications to hire us. One: Must have a BA from an English speaking country, Two: Be healthy. Those are the major ones. Very little do they ask us to be "Moral standing citizens" or have degrees in English, teaching experience...etc. Your own country sets the standards for which brings us over here. Still, being qualified or not people are going to do what they want. If you don't want to have this kind of behavior in your country then wouldn't it be better to talk to us in a community setting, instead of lashing out on the internet? Because we see the kind of drunken-cut-loose Korean culture we likely feel it is okay to feel free to do the same. I don't like "Black OUt Korea" and I don't like this blog either. Because neither are finding a way to communicate effectively with each other, and instead just cause anger.
Answer : Thanks for your considerable comment. I do dislike this blog too indeed.
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Roboseyo said, "what would you say if I told you I knew the writer of Blackout Korea's blog, that he has a Ph.D in Korean studies, and speaks Korean fluently, teaches at a university in Korea, and has tried everything a scholar can do to start a public discussion about the international disgrace that Korea's public drunkenness is... but no reporter or journalist would take up his story, no other scholars cared, and so he finally made the website blackout Korea in hopes that THIS method would finally cause a public discussion in Korea about public drunkenness. You don't know who made the site blackout Korea. You're assuming an awful lot, to automatically think it's an English teacher."
+ I find it confusing that your blog name is "englishteachersout" instead of something actually related to the stated purpose of your blog - for example "Blackoutkorea is a dumb blog" -- you seem to be conflating blackout korea with ALL english teachers, which is racist and wrong.
Answer : You skipped three things,
① There are ethics to be kept in every social(or scientific) experiment.
② Public discussions have been existing all the time, about World's drunkenness, foreign criminals and low quality English teachers in Korea.
③ I am blaming all of idiots in Photos, not only their King idiot.
+ As you see my writings(I hope), I try to write logically. The URL of this blog(englishteachersout) and its title(Who teaches English in Korea) are strongly related to Black Out Korea Blog. Hint : I said, "teaches".
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Seeing Seoul said, "Nowhere does the Republic of Korea stipulate that these foreign teachers must NOT enjoy taking photos of themselves with Koreans who have had too much to drink."
Answer : I understand your mention doesn't mean you will copy the idiot behavior tonight because I assume you as a morally qualified English teacher. Please read and understand what author is pointing out before you comment something on the internet.
Yeah, the only thing I see bad about this is the passed out drunks. And it doesn't look like those are all English teachers.
ReplyDeleteI would be more concerned with a culture that tolerates such extreme cases of binge drinking and where staff are expected to attend hwe-shik and drink to excess, leading to people passing out in the street as documented here, than I would with so-called "Unqualified teachers".
ReplyDeleteKoreans on average drink more than 12.5 litres of pure alcohol per year (see here: http://www.google.com/url?q=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.buzzfeed.com%2Fashleybaccam%2Fthe-drunkest-place-in-the-world&sa=D&sntz=1&usg=AFQjCNFFem4urMwmVD_H2xPffr4Gqky8qQ) matched only by Russia when it comes to alcohol consumption.
What sort of society thinks it is acceptable to drink until you pass out on the street like these pictures indicate? Koreans' first response should not be to blame "Unqualified teachers" but to take a serious look at their own behaviour and condemn this alcoholism.
The only reason this is an issue is because you are embarrassed. Your Korean countrymen and women in these photos have lost face, not only for themselves, but for all of Korea.
And that is the shame here.
Also your comparison between Korea and Iraq is disingenuous at best. Speaking of qualified etc. Lindy England, the infamous woman from the Abu Garib photos you equate to the other photos here is a high school drop out with no post secondary school education.
ReplyDeleteVery mich the epitome of "unqualified".
Do you even know the qualifications required to become an English Teacher in Korea?
According to Immigration law an E2 (conversation teacher) Visa holder must hold a degree issued in one of the 7 nations where English is the official language
That is all.
So if a teacher is teaching (legally) in Korea, by the very definition of the Korean government they are "Qualified" It is an unthinking, knee-jerk reaction that is too often over-used by Koreans to blame incidents like these on "Unqualified" English teachers?
What is an "Unqualified" Teacher? Like I said, if a teacher is here legally, according to the government they are qualified.
On this note it would serve Korea to actually lift the requirements of education of prospective E2 visa applicants - make them have a teaching degree or an English related degree, mandate that teachers who come to Korea must be over 25 etc etc. Instead Korean schools are only interested in looking good, hiring the blond and blue eyed foreigner at the cheapest rate while they are unwilling to pay experienced and educated teachers because they cost too much.
For example GEPIK not renewing teachers' contracts this year if they fell into the experienced (and expensive) category on the pay scale.
It is an assumption that the non-Koreans shown here are teachers and an unfounded one at that. I would note too that there are a couple of passed out non-Koreans who are being made fun of, alongside their Korean counterparts.
Again look to your own culture and the things that Korea lets happen. See how you are embarrassing yourselves before pointing your finger at a group that you are erroneously calling "Unqualified".
그건 그렇고, 난 한국어로 작성했을하지만 난 아직도 학생이야. 감사합니다.
ReplyDeleteIraqis seem really conservative, but they really let go at night! You can't go anywhere around Baghdad late at night without seeing a bunch standing around naked with bags on their heads, lying down on floors with collars and leashes around their necks, getting into naked pyramids and such. But seriously, if they're cool with such self-imposed humiliation, why not pose for a picture with them?
ReplyDelete"Just hope you to realize a fact that you can sleep on a street in Korea. No one will hurt you as you heard a news in your country."
ReplyDeleteAre you serious here?
Three days ago I read a blog post from a woman who passed out in the street, and woke up naked in a hotel room with a middle-aged Korean man, also naked, about to rape her. I can't find it back because it was linked from a whole bunch of other posts from women who were having similar experiences.
"It's a clear fact that most English teachers working in Korea are not qualified to teach a language. They just grew up in English countries."
ReplyDeleteFirst of all, define "qualified".
Second, just for the argument's sake, let's assume you're right: most English teachers in Korea are not qualified to teach English. My question then becomes: Whose fault is that?
Is Korean Immigration at fault for only requiring a university degree and a clean criminal record as qualifications? Or are schools at fault when they refuse to hire more qualified teachers, choosing instead to hire younger teachers with ZERO teaching background or experience?
I have a background in English education and 20+ years of teaching experience in several subjects--not only English--in four different countries, and yet I've lost more than one job to "teachers" fresh out of university, who have never had a job before, have never taught before, and have no background in education.
So whose fault is it again that "unqualified" teachers get hired in Korea, and experienced teachers are not?
I think I have been confused as someone else. I have never protested Google Street View. I love Google Street View. I wish Google would come and do "Inside My Apartment View" if it meant I could find things when I needed them.
ReplyDeleteI agree that Korea is a safe place comparatively, but there is a difference to being able to sleep on a sidewalk without fear of being harassed and the social problems that obviously exist if drinking until you PASS OUT in the street is such a common occurrence.
Again, I would be looking inward at the bigger problem than a few idiots, who may or may not be English Teachers and who are not representative of the vast majority of us who are VERY well qualified, and stay in Korea because we love it and its people.
Schools ask for certain qualifications to hire us. One: Must have a BA from an English speaking country
ReplyDeleteTwo: Be healthy
Those are the major ones. Very little do they ask us to be "Moral standing citizens" or have degrees in English, teaching experience...etc.
Your own country sets the standards for which brings us over here.
Still, being qualified or not people are going to do what they want.
If you don't want to have this kind of behavior in your country then wouldn't it be better to talk to us in a community setting, instead of lashing out on the internet?
Because we see the kind of drunken-cut-loose Korean culture we likely feel it is okay to feel free to do the same.
I don't like "Black OUt Korea" and I don't like this blog either. Because neither are finding a way to communicate effectively with each other, and instead just cause anger.
I think you are totally right to be disgusted with the actions of idiots who should remember that they are guests in this country. It's wrong to take pictures of people without their consent, and more wrong to publish those pictures on the internet.
ReplyDeleteI don't think your comparison with Abu Ghraib is at all fair. The U.S. Army was torturing prisoners there. In Korea, in the pictures above, the "teachers" are merely taking pictures of people who have passed out because of their own actions. I agree that the people making these pictures and posting on that blog are idiots and they need to learn some respect.
Sure that the Koreans (not clear if all those who passed out are Koreans as much as it is unclear whether the photo takers are foreign English teachers) in those pictures should drink more responsibly and that they are at fault.
ReplyDeleteHowever, what is fundamentally wrong about the BOK site is its very intention, a RACIST one indeed, to demonize or ridicule the entire Korean population. (No doubt this is "race"- and "hatred"-based as the site picks on a certain race/nation and encourages people to participate in mocking its people.)
If a normal person sees a passed-out person on the street, his or her first response would be to be concerned of the safety of that person and to call the police or his/her family/friends for help. Instead, these expats are laughing and circulating photos. To any civilized person, they are no better than the passed-out people. (I would rather be a drunk person than a racist.) In fact, I think they are worse and they are humiliating themselves.
And you can always find some bad examples or some horror stories from a random blog site. But you cannot simply generalize them. Those who do so are only showing their lack of knowledge in basic statistics and scientific reasoning. Such idiocy can even elect a wrong president (e.g., G.W. Bush) and strikes unnecessary wars (e.g., Iraq War) and kills.
You can find examples of binge drinking in the U.S., U.K, Canada, etc., too. (I have seen them at college dorm, subway, bar, street or you name it.) In particular, the U.S. even has a celebrity gossip culture about binge drinking (e.g., media coverage of Lindsay Lohan). But have you seen a website solely dedicated to mocking the entire American people for their binge drinking? (Perhaps there is, but I haven't seen one yet.) If not, why only Korea? WHO reports that Czechs, Hungarians, Russians, Romanians, etc. consume more alcohol per capita than Koreans and that Irish people drink about the same. Then, where are sites called, for instance, "Black Out Ireland"? (And I think this could be why some people can be suspicious of who these photo takers are. What are the demographics of foreigners in Korea different from the ones of foreigners in, let's say, Hungary? [E2 and USFK people first come to my mind.])
And speaking of E2 people, not all but many foreign English teachers come to Korea because they cannot get a decent job in their home country. (In a way, they are economic refuges or low lives of the economic, social pyramid in their homeland.)
ReplyDeleteI don't think there is anything particularly wrong about capitalizing their English "skills(?)" to survive. It is unfortunate to the rest (e.g., Koreans, Chinese, or Japanese native speakers) but English is the most popular lingua franca. Since there is demand for the language, E2 people are at an advantage and they are welcomed to take it. (Even now, we are discussing this in English, not in Korean; hence, skewing the playing field to E2 people.)
However, what is not Okay is their racism and disrespect to the country that is providing them with opportunities for survival. (I'm not saying that all E2-ers are racists.) If the photo takers are indeed E2 teachers, they are not only racists but they are hypocrites and even may have some inferiority issues--trying to cover up their feeling of inferiority (feeling inferior to their native competitors with a professional career who in a way forced them to Korea). If they are so unhappy about Korea and think that it is the worst country in the world, why won't they go back home and have a better life that they so much desire? The answer seems like simply they cannot. They have no real "skills" that are considered marketable outside Korea (or China or Japan).
So, what do they decide to do? To create a "community"(?) (e.g., BOK site and many other blog sites that some commentators here may be part of) of people like themselves and bitch about Korea or Koreans because, I suspect, it helps them feel superior and forget that in their home country they are nobody. If this is true, I find them completely delusional and psychopathic. It's just plain sad. They make other civilized E2 people look bad.
Get some real help. (I am not trying to demonize all E2-ers, but only the ones that have that inferiority issue.)
그냥 자기나라에서 한국으로 "경제적"피난 온 것에 대한 열등감, 또 뼈까지 배어있는 인종차별주의때문에 한국 깍아내리게에 바쁜 듯. 그렇게 발버둥쳐봤자 한국은 별 상관없이 계속 성장해왔고 또 지금도 하고있으며 서구국가들을 하나하나 재끼고 있음.
ReplyDeletewhat would you say if I told you I knew the writer of Blackout Korea's blog, that he has a Ph.D in Korean studies, and speaks Korean fluently, teaches at a university in Korea, and has tried everything a scholar can do to start a public discussion about the international disgrace that Korea's public drunkenness is...
ReplyDeletebut no reporter or journalist would take up his story, no other scholars cared, and so he finally made the website blackout Korea in hopes that THIS method would finally cause a public discussion in Korea about public drunkenness.
You don't know who made the site blackout Korea. You're assuming an awful lot, to automatically think it's an English teacher.
Can't say I'm the biggest fan of the BOK site - especially of the photos of people posing with their 'trophies.' An example of neo-colonial attitudes by young people who are living in a foreign country for the first time? Perhaps. But the 25-year-old stereotypes you bring up about unqualified foreign teachers who can't find jobs back home are not helpful either.
ReplyDeleteBefore I begin, take a moment to imagine who I am.
ReplyDeleteOf course the comment I left above is ludicrous. That's because it's ludicrous to compare blackoutkorea (BOK) with Abu Ghraib. In the former, the "victims" have freely and voluntarily put themselves in their positions/conditions, and will have no memory whatsoever of the people posing with them (and yes, those people posing with the drunks are jackasses). But in Abu Ghraib, you have prisoners, taken by force and compelled to engage in acts of degradation-- surely remembering clearly each moment of humiliation.
It is likewise unfair to attribute the bad behavior of these expats to all English teachers. Saying "It's a clear fact that most English teachers working in Korea are not qualified to teach a language" is not only de jure incorrect (since they have the qualifications set by Korean law), it is unrelated to their behavior. There are plenty of E-2 (English teacher) visa holders who are consummate professionals despite having only the legally required qualifications. And there are surely examples of bad behavior from people having the credentials that should ostensibly limit such boorishness. When a diplomat abuses his immunity and drives recklessly, we do not call him an "unqualified diplomat"; nor when a US soldier commits a crime is he called an "unqualified soldier". We call them lawbreakers.
My comment is satire: it is a suggestion of what the author of this blog might think expats to believe. Of course you don't actually believe it-- nor should anyone with any intelligence. But who would actually believe it? Someone who thinks BOK and Abu Ghraib are comparable, and thinks that expats unilaterally approve of the sort of stupid posing on BOK. Of course you took offense-- but certainly no more than anyone else reading who sees such a trivialization of the genuine human suffering in Abu Ghraib, or resented being lumped in with those goons simply by merit of their profession.
(Continued)
ReplyDeleteBut calling me a "devil" and inviting attention to my personal life? That's not justified. My picture of an eccentrically-styled man on a bus and joke about him looking like Super Mario (especially in the context of having recently taken a picture of a man dressed in a Pikachu outfit) has NOTHING to do with his race or nationality, and it's unreasonable to compare me to the boors posing in the pictures. Do you become racist when finding humor in how an expat is dressed? No, you don't. No more--and no less-- than I do when I find humor in when I see a fellow like that on the bus. I do not lose the right to be amused by people simply because I have left my country. Honestly, I have a lot of respect for people like the guy in my picture; he's got his own style and isn't afraid to show it. After commenting the first time, I began to think there would be a risk of "retaliation", so I deleted my long-defunct blog. Turns out I was right to do so.
You have every right to think that the BOK blog is in bad taste. But the website www.peopleofwalmart.com is no more or less offensive, and no more or less indicative of Americans in general than is BOK of Koreans. I don't hear much (if any) complaints about that site. I don't think the solo BOK pictures are any worse than www.peopleofwalmart.com (it's not showing anything that isn't commonly seen), but I totally agree with you that the "posing" pictures are juvenile and in bad taste.
But you're taking your anger out on the wrong target. In the first part I asked you to imagine who I am. (You have my blog contents, so you have all you'd need to know, presumably.) But nonetheless: I am not an English teacher. I am married to a Korean and have two Korean children (who speak Korean but not yet English). I do not drink. I do not smoke. I am a US-licensed attorney. I rarely come into contact with any expats except online. I do not, after 11 hours of defending the interests of my employer each day, have the time, energy, or desire to go around posing with drunks. I am certainly one of the most benign expats you will find, and, going by your strict standards, probably one of the more useful. At least let me have my thoughts.
To take these photos as "proof" that "all English teachers are disrespectful and unqualified" is absurd. Likewise, these pohotos could be used to illustrate the point that "all Koreans are drunks that pass out stone-cold in public places". I'm sure the author of this blog would find that conclusion to be racist and unjustified.
ReplyDeleteThe qualifications for foreigners to come teach a foreign language in Korea are set by the MOJ and the Korean Immigration Service. Those qualifications are: 1) A 4-year Bachelor's degree from an accredited university (which now must be notarized, apostilled, and verified) from one of the seven recognized English-speaking countries. 2) A federal-level criminal background check (which now must also be notarized and apostilled). 3) A medical check, which now includes testing for HIV/AIDS and drugs. Nowhere does the Republic of Korea stipulate that these foreign teachers must NOT enjoy taking photos of themselves with Koreans who have had too much to drink.
These foreigners are NOT representative of the vast majority of non-citizens currently working as language teachers in Korea. Please think before you publish something on the internet condemning an entire population because of the actions of a few.
http://briandeutsch.blogspot.com/2007/12/2007-in-case-you-missed-it.html
ReplyDeletecan you take the behavior of a few people in a group, and use it to make judgments about all?
I find it confusing that your blog name is "englishteachersout" instead of something actually related to the stated purpose of your blog - for example "Blackoutkorea is a dumb blog" -- you seem to be conflating blackout korea with ALL english teachers, which is racist and wrong.
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ReplyDeleteHere is the website that BOK's bloger's interviewed last year. http://matadornetwork.com/nights/extreme-binge-drinking-on-display-an-interview-with-black-out-korea/
ReplyDeleteUnfortunately, he is an English teacher from the U.S. and posted these ridiculos pictures to get people's attentions. He doesnt have any good intention like you think he might have.
술에취해 정신을 잃은 한국의 블로거가 작년에 인터뷰한 내용이에요. 아쉽게도 그는 미국에서 온 영어선생이고 사람의 주목을 받기위해 사진들을 인터넷에 올리기 시작했죠. 당신이 생각하는 좋은 의도는 없었던거에요.
And I think you might misunderstand the meaning of an unqulified teacher. This counter bloger was talking about their undeveloped characters. In Korea, teachers are required to not only have BA degree but also take moral classes to build good characters. So, they can be positive role models. I dont think it is different in other countries because I went to a school in the US and met great professors that were deserved my respects. Can you respect BOK bloger and take him as your role model? If not, he is unqualified. 여기에서 말하는 자격미달이란 선생님의 자질을 말하는거에요. 한국에서 선생님은 대학을 졸업해야하고 본보기가 될만한 자질을 가져야 하거든요. 다른나라라고 해서 다를거라고 생각하지 않아요. 미국에서 존경받을만한 교수님들을 많이 만났거든요. 당신은 BOK블로거를 존경할수 있나요? 아니라면 그는 자격미달이에요.
I can infer your personality from your writing, look into your culture. Do you think that you are better than anyone else by any chance? And the truth is we look into our culture. There are many TV programs talking about these social issues everyday. We discuss and try to find better solution. Blind yourself isnot our responsibility. 당신의 글(너희문화를 반성해라)로 미루어 짐작컨데.. 당신은 다른 사람보다 잘났다고 생각하시는분이시군요. 많은 티비프로그램은 사회문제를 다루고 있고 우리는 얘기하고 더 나은 해결방법을 찾으려고 노력하고 있답니다. 무지하셨다면 그건 우리의 책임이아니구요.
"Can you respect BOK bloger and take him as your role model? If not, he is unqualified."
ReplyDeleteIf your litmus test for being "qualified" to be a teacher is that they must be deserving of respect, then I'd say at least 50-60% of Korean public school teachers I've worked with are unqualified. I simply don't respect drunks or abusers.
"If a normal person sees a passed-out person on the street, his or her first response would be to be concerned of the safety of that person and to call the police or his/her family/friends for help."
ReplyDeleteI've lived in Korea nearly 15 years. I can't remember anyone helping or calling the police/family of a person who has passed out on the streets. I'm sure there must have been, but it's happened so seldomly that I simply can't recall it ever happening. I guess there aren't many "normal people" in Korea, by your definition.
"I have my masters degree in teaching. I've lived in Korea for almost 10 years. I am studying Korean. But I wont stay in Korea. No matter what I do I will never be welcomed here. A few people act stupid and I always get blamed as well for their mistakes. Everyone thinks that because I am white I am a looser who couldnt get a job back home. Korean's tell me to get out of their country."
ReplyDeleteYep. Been here nearly 15 years myself, and I won't stay in Korea forever, either.
Although I have the respect of both my foreign and Korean colleagues and junior staff members; although I no longer even teach English (I teach a different subject altogether in university); although I have lived here a long time and have a great respect for Korea's customs, culture and language; although I am not American... people see my white face and still ASS-U-me I'm a loser American English teacher who can't get a job back home.
Maybe if people here weren't so quick to superficially judge people, MAYBE there would be fewer problems. Not all foreigners are American. Not all foreigners are teachers. Not all foreigners are losers and idiots. Hell, there's a million foreigners in Korea, most don't even speak English.
Get to know us and judge us on our actions and our individual character. Don't pre-judge us all on the actions of a few idiots. There are 20,000 legal teachers here in Korea, the vast majority of them are actually decent people.
Just as I don't judge all Koreans on basis of the lying and deceipt of two or three previous employers, so should Koreans not judge all foreigners on the basis of a handful of idiots and sensationalistic biased "news" reports.
http://abcnews.go.com/WhatWouldYouDo/video/teens-drunk-public-teenage-wasted-drinking-beer-what-would-you-do-wwyd-12620692
ReplyDelete1 in 3 of you will help drunk *white* kids.
Only 1 in 12 of you will help drunk *black* kids.
Those are higher numbers than people in Korea helping drunk Korean men. Even Korean police ignore drunks on the street.
ReplyDelete@Roboseyo
ReplyDeleteYou say: "[W]hat would you say if I told you I knew the writer of Blackout Korea's blog, that he has a Ph.D in Korean studies, and speaks Korean fluently, teaches at a university in Korea, and has tried everything a scholar can do to start a public discussion about the international disgrace that Korea's public drunkenness is..."
This is a bit la-la-land nonsense. I'm not sure if you have had any graduate training, but higher academic institutions have ethical review boards (in the U.S. they are called "IRBs") that keep researchers in check.
You say: "You don't know who made the site blackout Korea. You're assuming an awful lot, to automatically think it's an English teacher."
Actually, BOK site was created by a foreign English teacher:
http://matadornetwork.com/nights/extreme-binge-drinking-on-display-an-interview-with-black-out-korea
@DB
Maybe, but they don't take photos and circulate them online like racist foreigners in those pictures and the English teacher who created the site do in Korea.
And the more you try to shift the topic and blame the fault all on Korea/the entire Korean population (and you have repeatedly done so to divert), the more you are displaying your racism.
And if you indeed want Koreans to "[g]et to know [you]," then why don't you drop your white supremacy or start communicating with Koreans here in Korean--the language that they can understand to get to know you.
Your hypocrisy and empty words are really disgusting.
First, I an NOT shifting the topic and blaming all Koreans. I blamed the schools for hiring "unqualified" teachers with zero experience or passion for teaching instead of hiring people who have the education and experience and maturity to do their jobs well, without the childish idiocy.
ReplyDeleteSecond, I don't fault the entire Korean population, as you claim. Please quote where I said anything of the kind. Nowhere. You claimed "normal people" would help such drunken people lying on the street, and I countered that rarely does anyone (Korean or foreign or even the police) help these people passed out on the streets. That's not blaming anyone; it's a simple statement of fact.
Third, this is an English blog where the owner and commenters are communicating in English. My purpose for posting here is not for Koreans to get to know me. I post elsewhere for that purpose, both in English AND in Korean. DB is the name I use in English forums; I use a different name in the Korean ones.
Finally, to counter that these kinds of photos are taken only in Korea and only because "foreigners are racist":
http://tinyurl.com/4f5hf39
If anything, the racist rhetoric you've used here against foreigners is worse than anything I've said here, so I guess that makes you the real hypocrite.
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ReplyDelete@DB
ReplyDelete그리고 이제 너 따위한테는 내가 괜히 네 편의 봐주면서 네 말로 대화해 줄 가치조차도 없거든. 할 말 있으면 15년이나 한국에서 살았으니까 한국말로 해. 네가 한국사람이 너희들을 이해해 주라고 요구하면 너도 당연히 나한테 한국말로 해야되는거 아냐?
Here is the facebook of Blackout Korea: http://www.facebook.com/pages/Black-Out-Korea/128220428095#
ReplyDeleteThere was a site renewal!
ReplyDeleteWelcome everyone :D
Best
Bintz